So have the students grades fallen as a result of the previous layoffs? Is there a decline of student enrollment? I dont see these answered here.....Times are tough right now and I dont see anyone willing to taking pay cuts to save the other jobs...sad but it is reality...I dont quite understand who the message is for and what the message is intended for...and If i saw my teacher out in front of the school demonstrating..id think a lot less of them...

so teachers should just shut up and take it? quietly go away and never let the parents or the public know just how deep the cuts are? the teachers were also providing information for interested parties on how to contact their legislator. so auburnite, according to you, teachers should make sure that the kids grades fall when times are tough -then you would pay attention. you say "I dont (sic) see anyone willing to taking (sic) pay cuts to save other jobs..." Look at Sierra College, where an across the board 5% pay cut is happening. since nobody demonstrated, i guess you don't know about it....

I have a hard time feeling sorry for the schools( any schools). Theres a heck of a lotta waste in every school disctrict. Does every district need a superintendent?.... no. Does every school need a principal?.....no. You can thank the school boards for the outrageous salaries of the superintendent and principals. When I was in school, there was anywhere from 26 to 38 kids in a class, and nobody complained about it, it just goes to show that the unions control the schools. All govt union contracts need to be re-written, then the county would'nt be in such bad shape.

Parents already know how "deep" the cuts are in the government sector --- not deep enough to solve the decades old problem of overspending. Parents are the ones who are paying the bills...not the teachers. Of course it would be nice to have all the money that school boards, administrators, and teachers could create a program for, but that's just not reality. I empathize with the teachers completely! but that doesn't solve the problem of a weak economy and not enough money being generated by the private sector to pay all the taxes that EVERY government agency wants.

Yes, our kids education is important. But when we look back at our country's history we can see that the greatest periods of achievement and technical/industrial growth were when schools were operating like Somalian dirt farmers compared to what we have today. There were no computers, televisions, radios, airplanes, etc., for most of our early history...yet we grew from an agrarian society with almost no mechanical industry to one of the giants of the 19th century. The 20th century was amazing, yet much of the education was still being done in one room schools or technologically-deprived institutions that relied on rote learning instead of gimicks and screens. Yet, we became the most technically advanced civilization in the history of the world. It wasn't because money was flowing like the muddy Mississippi. It was because kids, parents, and educators worked with what they had, and had big dreams.

Deja_View, auburnnative,

I'm a teacher and I agree with you completely. No, most teachers are not overpaid - but the administrative waste is vast.

Unfortunately since they hold the power, they'll cut everything else before they inconvenience themselves. The whole system will have to ultimately collapse before it can get better.

Oh, and NO, taxpayers shouldn't throw another dime at this system. Over half of the budget of the 7th largest economy in the world aught to be enough to get the job done, wouldn't you think?

my mother grew up during the depression. her high school had a marching band, a women's basketball team and a full music program. she used to tell me, "no matter how poor we were, we always had music at school." what we call the "greatest generation" grew up poor, but their communities took great pride in their schools. everyone worked hard to make sure that their children had a solid education. my father went to a one room school from kindergarten through high school, yet he still remembers when his high school basketball team went to the state championship. they had sports! imagine that. dirt poor, but they had sports and music at school.

Birdstrike; i agree 100%, thankyou.

If we all plant money trees this spring, problems should be over by fall! - About all that's left at the bottom of the well is mud - wish I had the answer - but there needs to be cuts at some point, you can only furlough & squeeze so much out,

Teachers, on average, spend $3,000-$5,000 of their own money on school supplies on items related to the classroom. Teaching is the one profession that EVERY body else things they know how to do better. Everybody has an opinion on what the teacher is doing wrong. Its a 24/7 profession. When the bell sounds at the end of the day, teachers dont just get to go home and forget about work. They go above and beyond what most jobs require, and for a starting pay of $38K a year in California, we can do better than that. To whoever says that our best technical achievements have occurred when we had bare bones education, your just flat wrong.

I think the avg pay would be a better number to use & if I am not mistaken, I think there are 180 "work" days a year? & like every other job out there if people don't want it they don't have to apply, what do private sector teachers make? - These days there are a lot of people who would like a job at all, especially on with full benefit packages - I do not think teacher pay is the issue here, the model is not working period & there is plenty of blame to pass around, solutions are the question. Teachers unions have one take, "departments of education" have another, fiscal conservatives yet another - consolidation & cuts are a start - return to local control may be another - too many hands in the pot - shared administration..... Boards, Parents & Teachers should be scrutinizing the budgets - tough decisions have to be made! There are a lot of important jobs out there, and a lot of people who would like not to have cuts, layoffs or reductions in pay - but reality is there is only so much money to go around.

History

http://www.faqs.org/childhood/Th-W/Urban-School-Systems-the-Rise-of.html

http://www.cloudnet.com/~edrbsass/educationhistorytimeline.html

http://library.thinkquest.org/J002606/Timeline.html

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/us_education_spending_20.html

I agree with auburnnative....no teachers and admins are willing to take pay cuts, or even limit the amount of days they were to save money. For that reason, I have no sympathy for those.

Jayber, a 5% cut would be preferable to pink slips galore. The private sector has seen layoffs & more layoffs accompanied by multiple cuts in pay. Like 4 times what you seem to think Sierra College employees are "suffering" from....

Additionally, as I posted earlier this week, the problem with education funding in California is multi-faceted. There's too many layers of bureaucracy with the Federal, State, County and Local boards of education. Of course, state and federal mandates created many of these layers and they never go away. With them come restrictions on how funds are budgeted (classified & unclassified) and that ties the local districts in how they can put monies where they need to most.

Finally, the Ca. proposition program makes it too easy for people to be swayed to vote in requirements to educational funding without understanding the implications. They vote for propositions which put restrictions on funding because "it's for the schools" and their led down the primrose pass without realizing the proposition will never do what the people who sold it to them said it would.

The public sector is getting his this year because their budget cycles are based on the prior year. 2008 wasn't too bad, compared to 2009. So the cuts in the government/state/education are going to be deep & wide this year. The private sector was hit first and is still struggling. But our countries leadership says the economy is over. Yeah, right.

JamminJahMon,

As I said before, I'm not saying that, for the most part, work hard and care very deeply. But unfortunately, you are wrong about your idea that a larger "edbiz" (or "the blob", as journalist Peter Brimelow describes it) has a positive influence on student achievement. In fact, the relationship is INVERSE.

Did you know that literacy in this country peaked around the same time institutional schools were developed? It has gone down ever since.

Do you know what the fruits of massive, unprecedented increases of spending gained us as a result of the landmark congressional study entitled "A Nation At Risk" were? We went BACKWARDS by every measure. The U.S. is now pretty much at the bottom of all industrial nations - and behind some 3rd-world nations - in educational achievement.

We throw way, way too much money at government schooling (don't confuse it with "education"). Yes, many teachers are overworked and underpaid - but this is simply another reason not to reward the monster.

kud - I never said that Sierra College was "suffering" a 5% paycut. I was responsding to auburnite's statement: "I dont see anyone willing to taking pay cuts to save the other jobs." Sierra College employees were willing to take a paycut to minimize layoffs there. Believe me, I wish that Weimar Hills had voted to take pay cuts instead of cutting all electives. I shouldn't really have started posting in response to this article - I have too much at stake and it feels really bad to read the comments here and feel the lack of support....and, dare I say, hostility. sigh.

I attended a large public meeting approximately six years ago at Placer Hills Elementary School when the teachers and the administration reached an impasse in their contract negotiations. This financial situation was predicted at that time by then District Superintendent Ken Poulsen. Mr. Poulsen informed the attendees that the district was experiencing declining enrollment and would continue to do so based on the district’s future enrollment projections. At that time, the district had a healthy financial reserve. At the meeting a vocal majority of the attendees, which consisted primarily of teachers and parents of students, implored the school board and the administration to use the reserve to pay salaries. Mr. Poulsen very clearly explained that the budget wasn’t sustainable because using the district’s reserves to pay salary increases would ultimately erode the reserve and the district would face a deficit unless other sources of additional revenue could be found in the future.

The difficult situation the district faces today is in part due to the economy but is also due to the adoption of an unsustainable budget, amongst other factors. We have a great school district in our community with wonderful teachers teaching good kids and run by a well meaning administration. Unfortunately the current educational economic model just isn’t working. The unfortunate reality is that the district must find a way to balance its’ budget and finger pointing isn’t the …

jayber, I don't think its hostility. Its frustration. People demanding funding when there is no money in the proverbial pot. Tax revenues from last year are through the floor seriously and for the 'education" regiment (local schools, colleges, teachers, students) to encourage everyone to protest and demand their fair share when there are millions out of of work just seems extremely self serving and short sighted. There's no reality check. And I think a lot of people are suffering in this economy and are tired of people demanding more and more while there are less and less people putting money into the "community coffers". I don't see it getting better with the attitude our administration is taking. And in California, well, we're just screwed royally anyway with the lame Schwarzenegger, and the even lamer legislature we have in office.

"so teachers should just shut up and take it? quietly go away and never let the parents or the public know just how deep the cuts are?" jayber I have been layed off jobs before, I didnt act like a whining child and protest, its a fact of life...and not a good example we should be setting for our children. From what I see on these websites, teacher pay has not dropped but increased, and the average seems to be $60k per year plus benefits, for 9 months of work, not bad pay. If the teachers really cared for the well being of the students, and each other, one would think they would be willing to take pay cuts, to keep other teachers employed..and students educated but that is not the case....teachers are not entitled, nor are the rest of workers. If you want to control your employment, be self employed and see how that goes... teacher pay website...http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cache:Vj9Qho2go4QJ:www.sacbee.com/local/story/2476037.html+california+department+of+education+teacher+average+salary+district&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&appSession=231415902261078

Birdstrike very thoughtful and a lot of COMMON SENSE which is so lacking in our education system. When Common sense clashes with Ego's and Greed , guess what usually looses? Would sure like to hear more from Birdstrike please.

The bottom line is that with summer school being cut, no councilers, no aids for kindergarden, no computer lab, no P.E., no after school programs, and very large class room sizes- What happens to the child who is struggling in a subject? What if both parents work and are barely making it as it is? The parents cannot afford to suppliment with tudoring- so the child falls behind, slips through the cracks? We do not live in a thrid world country, however our education system will be lacking as such. What outlet will the children have without any after school programs? Not all parents are "involved" and those are the kids who really depend on these things to keep them out of trouble. The teachers bust their A*SES! Yet are the first ones to get SH*! on. Go figure?

We are faced with a major crisis in education. Unfortunately all I see is complaining, no one seems to have any suggestions beyond the "raise taxes" solution. The parents, even if they both work must put in some time with their kids.

I would like to see a group comprised of teachers, Administrators and parents meet regularly to try to reach some sort of agreement, solution or what have you. I would also like to see all the unfunded mandates for schools stopped immediately, schools should be places where the children go to lear, the "reaising" of children belongs in the home, same as feeding, clothing, etc.

chicksrule: Have you ever studied without someone telling you to? Perhaps you can tutor those who need it during a volunteer tutoring session? Do your parents teach you anything? Perhaps you can learn to do yard work during the summer?

I have only one question, why is auburnite such an idiot?

I for one would like to know why Placer County Office of Education just recarpeted the entire office (when it was done a few years ago), purchased brand new desks (to replace the old one that are less than 5 years old) and has not one but TWO large flat screen TVs that do nothing but flash the logo on and off all day.

To me, THAT is not only wasteful, but a blatant disregard for the needs of the students. That money could have been spent on much better things.

Where is all the Lottery Money going ? LOL. What a joke that turned out to be. Was that not suppose to fix our financial problems?

Has anyone heard of any administrators getting pink slips?

Gold Panner: I volunteer in my childs class already...5 hours a week. Donate to the countless fundraisers. Take my kids to their sports. This is not about ME, i do my part to help the school out. Like i said, there are parents out there who are not involved, and those children count on these programs. It is the schools job to teach our children. You and auburnite should get together, you would make great friends! Your both idiots!

Let's talk fundraisers in the public schools. Huh? They used to come to my door selling MnM's for their science lab. What?!? I think the chickens have finally come home to roost in the school districts and their mismanagement of the peoples' tax dollars. Kids don't really need much to be educated, they need books (can be old ones), a place to sit and write (can be old desks), pencils and paper, teachers who care and parents who support them and voila...education takes place. What a concept.

GailBegin, you are oversimplifying a very complex problem. Being a former volunteer fire fighter in same community, I can assure you that fundraising is not a reliable, predictable, or sustainable source of future revenue for any government agency, especially one with the magnitude of the statewide school system.

In some ways a budget crisis may be needed to help identify true priorities in an effort to cut waste and balance the budget. This type of “market correction” can’t happen overnight. Currently, 61.14% of every property tax dollar collected in Placer County goes to the schools (ref: pie chart distributed by Placer County Treasurer/Tax collector’s office that accompanied my most recent property tax statement). Education is labor intensive but the educational system must find ways to increase efficiency and productivity, just like the private sector is doing in the economically challenging times.

Eliminate Prop. 13

Chuxx;

Yeah, right. Nail the taxpayers again so they can't even afford their mortgages or basics. Good grief...when will you learn?!

Cick;

You bring up good points about the need for summer classes, etc. However, I have long contended that if we got back to a curriculum and policies that didn't allow students to advance until they absolutely know the basics of calculation and communication (100% instant recall of multiplication tables, not being allowed to say "...me and John did something today.." and total abuse of past/present tense, etc.) we would elimintae the need for remedial classes in both K-12 AND colleges. Kids today can remember how to program cell phones, games, computers and toys; spend hundreds of hours talking in gibberish and code to each other on electronic devices; remember every singer's birthday and who they were screwing over the past 20 years; ad nauseum. Don't tell me they can't memorize a few simple math and grammar rules. We could save $Billions by making sure it's done right ..THE FIRST TIME.

Saying that CA spends over 1/2 the budget on schools is meaningless. We rank 45 out 50 states in per student spending. THAT IS BEFORE THIS YEARS CUTS!!! Everyone has answers, yet nobody does the research.

By the way, my neighbor is a teacher and has not had a pay increase in 4 years, actually, she has lost money in each of these years due to rising health care costs. Oh yeah, and these great benefits people refer to cost her over $300 dollars a month to cover herself and her kids. She is not making 60k a year, I promise you that. Also, when did teaching become charity work? Why should they be expected to give up chunks of their salaries for other peoples kids? Don't they have kids of their own, mortgages, etc.? Aren't they entitled to a better quality of life? Why should they fund the mistakes big government has made. The taxpayers sure won't do it. It is their kids that are in teacher's classes.

Really gvbilly? Here is one reference I found inan internet search. What is your reference? We often hear stats tossed out in these types of discussions, but it's nice to get the facts. I'm curious where you got yours.

Expenditures per K-12 pupil in fall enrollment, 2005-06 Rank and Percentage of national average

California $8,486 Rank 29, Percentage of national average 93.3%

Texas $7,547 Rank 44, Percentage of national average 82.9%

New York $13,551 Rank 3, Percentage of national average 148.9%

Florida $7,762 Rank 41, Percentage of national average 85.3%

Illinois $9,456 Rank 21, Percentage of national average 103.9%

United States $9,100

Data: National Education Association (NEA) Rankings and Estimates 2006-07.

http://www.ed-data.k12.ca.us/Articles/article.asp?title=California%20comparison

I'm not sure if you know this, but it is not 2006-2007.

Source is CDE - Jack O'Connell state Superintendent's comments:

"While Quality Counts 2009 found that California has among the highest academic standards it the nation, it also reports that California ranks 47th in the nation in terms of per-pupil spending. This is a sad distinction considering the challenges we face to improve student achievement and close the achievement gap that exists between students who are white or Asian and their peers who are African American, Latino, or learning the English language.

California ranks 47th in the nation in terms of per-pupil spending

Published on Jan 9, 2009 - 5:55:54 AM

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By: California Department of Education

80% plus of the Education Budget goes to teachers salaries by law.

Money money money. Where do are kids rank in terms of education? I am not talking about intelligence our Kids are plenty smart they are just not taught enough. This has been a dumbing down of kids over the last 30 years or so that I have seen. I personally think it started in the late 70's with 'New Math" and Learn at Their Own Speed in the Classes at Alta Vista School, at the time supposedly a very good school in Auburn.

JeffRoot: Yes, I admit to making an oversimplification, but sometimes I think these government run programs (which the public schools are) can get way too overblown. Like, a while back there the schools "needed" computer labs in order for kids to be "computer literate." However, mostly what they did with those computers (which I am sure are now filling up landfills) is play little math games and other games that used to be played with basic flash cards and such. Today most kids, even ones who are not so wealthy, have their own personal computer at home. I just don't "get" what they say the kids "need."

At some point there will simply be no more money and we will have to go with "simple" anyway.

And that had very little to due with money it was some nit wits idea of modern education. Kids are not taught by Rote anymore which is just repition and memorization. Consequently they have such short attention spans.

It is not the whole reason but it is big difference in the way they taught through out history and that served us very well in the past. Also reading and writing basics and a bit one HISTORY AND GOVERNMENT. I mean the

history that made us such a great Nation and People.

the teachers at this school beg some parents for supplys and items for the nurse iam all for not losing teachers but you can not cut pe from students some programs can be cut but school districts need to find out were they need to save money cut staff at the higher levels before teachers cut superintend salery first.

The parents I know who have their children in Placer Hill Union schools are quite happy with the education their children are receiving, so those folks who are complaining about the quality and efficacy of today's education are missing the point... The problem is financial, and the remedy for the fiscal issues should be focused on the administrative costs--not on firing teachers or reducing the programs in place for students. Norcalgirl (who commented on the Placer County Office of Education frivolous expenditures) is exactly right! We have hundreds of students in portable classrooms while the administration staff spend far too much feathering their own nests.

watchit: In case you haven't heard, rote learning has been rightly discredited long ago....it bred a serious lack of concept learning.

chuxxr nailed it. Prop 13.

Mrs. Scotten is an excellent teacher, that would be a serious loss for Weimar.

Hang in there jayber, lots of people are behind you and the schools.

As a tax payer, I am sick and tired of hearing about how broke our schools are, and that they are firing teachers. The State has plenty of money for education, the reason the school's don't see any of it, is because the politicians are too busy spending it on their special interest political financial supporters. Oh, I almost forgot.....the teachers Union has paid these crooks off for years, and now they have turned around and screwed them....In the past, if organized crime bought a politician, they staid bought. I wish the teachers the best of luck in their struggle......Lose your Union, and let the politicians know that you won't vote for an incombent again. VOTE'M ALL OUT!!!!!

Yes, eliminate Proposition 13 and the whole damn initiative and referendum system. Governing from the ballot box is always a bad idea. Can anyone say "three strikes"? Now we spend more on prisons than higher education.